Suggestion: Change Default Icon Theme

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Suggestion: Change Default Icon Theme

jEsuSdA 8)-2
Hi!

What do you think about changing the default XFCE icon theme from Rodent
to Papirus.


IMHO there are several and important benefits:

+ Papirus is a great and very complete theme (I think is the most
complete icon theme by far). And almost every XFCE icon is included.

+ It is SVG based. And the svg files are extremely optimized, so, it
weighs very little.

+ It is free and GNU LGPL V3.0 licensed.

+ It is extremely modern.

+ Looks great in conjuction with Greybird GTK+ Theme (Used as default
theme for several XFCE distros) and other modern themes like Arc.

+ It has normal, dark, light and neutral versions to be used without any
problem with any gtk theme.

+ It has support for Folder Colors, Harcoded tray icons.

+ It is well mantained and almost every day Papirus is updated and new
icons are merged.

+ It could brings a great refresh to XFCE look.


I think there are a lot of advantages and I can't think any
disadvantage. What do you think about?


https://github.com/PapirusDevelopmentTeam/papirus-icon-theme


And here, some screenshots:

http://pasteall.org/pic/show.php?id=117632

http://pasteall.org/pic/show.php?id=117633

http://pasteall.org/pic/show.php?id=117634

http://pasteall.org/pic/show.php?id=117635

http://pasteall.org/pic/show.php?id=117636


Thanks! ;)




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Re: Suggestion: Change Default Icon Theme

Vinzenz Vietzke
Am 29.07.2017 um 20:42 schrieb jEsuSdA 8):
> + It is extremely modern.
>

[...]

> and I can't think any disadvantage.

There you mentioned one by yourself. ;)


> What do you think about?

Many people like those trendy flat and colour-bursting icon sets - and
some don't. I think Xfce as an upstream project should stay mostly
neutral which is why Greybird works so good. If there's need to pimp up
optics I'd hand that job over to distributions and/or users.

That aside, all other points you gave are absolutely valid.

vinz.
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Re: Suggestion: Change Default Icon Theme

jEsuSdA 8)-2
El 30/07/17 a las 18:09, Vinzenz Vietzke escribió:
> Am 29.07.2017 um 20:42 schrieb jEsuSdA 8):
>> + It is extremely modern.
>>
> [...]
>
>> and I can't think any disadvantage.
> There you mentioned one by yourself. ;)

Hahahaha! Good point! XD

But I think XFCE is very modern too. No disadvantage here. ;)

>
>> What do you think about?
> Many people like those trendy flat and colour-bursting icon sets - and
> some don't. I think Xfce as an upstream project should stay mostly
> neutral which is why Greybird works so good. If there's need to pimp up
> optics I'd hand that job over to distributions and/or users.

Yes. Of course a lot of distributions change and personalize each
desktop... but not all do that. One of the most important, Debian,
brings all the desktops as they comes from default.

In my opinion, the most important reason to change the default icon
theme for a new one is to bring a complete look and feel, a complete
desktop experience.

Since it is usual to have XFCE with a lot of other (and non-XFCE) apps
installed and a lot of filetypes, having a complete icon theme brings a
consistent feel. And providing this by default can projects a better
sense about XFCE. I think the Desktop is more than an app collection; it
is an entire experience.

As it is said: The devil is in the details.

And I think all of us know that, for this reason in the xfce.org site,
all the screenshots are taken using Faenza icon theme instead the XFCE
icon set. I think this is cause Faenza is another great modern and
complete icon theme and XFCE looks so great with it. And we all want
XFCE to like people. ;)

So, IMHO change the default icon theme will bring a significant
improvement and may helps to bring a great default XFCE desktop
experience for all users (even non personalized distributions). ;)


>
> That aside, all other points you gave are absolutely valid.

Thanks!

I propose Papirus cause it is really XFCE friendly and intuitive and
lightweight (like the XFCE is), but maybe another icon theme if they
have at least the same advantages. ;)

;)

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Re: Suggestion: Change Default Icon Theme

Albert Wagner
In reply to this post by Vinzenz Vietzke
The devil's advocate:  they are only intuitive to the artist who
invented them.  I can't guess what they are supposed to be without
coaching.  I hate learning a whole new set of icons;  I've memorized
those that I use.  There will always be people who like shiny new
things.  And there will always be people who prefer to stay with the
known and comfortable.
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Re: Suggestion: Change Default Icon Theme

Jeffrey Needle
I always change icon themes to Gnome.  I'm comfortable with them, and
too old to figure out new themes.

On 07/31/2017 01:12 AM, Albert Wagner wrote:

> The devil's advocate:  they are only intuitive to the artist who
> invented them.  I can't guess what they are supposed to be without
> coaching.  I hate learning a whole new set of icons; I've memorized
> those that I use.  There will always be people who like shiny new
> things.  And there will always be people who prefer to stay with the
> known and comfortable.
> _______________________________________________
> Xfce mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://mail.xfce.org/mailman/listinfo/xfce
> http://www.xfce.org

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Re: Suggestion: Change Default Icon Theme

jEsuSdA 8)-2
In reply to this post by Albert Wagner
El 30/07/17 a las 19:12, Albert Wagner escribió:
> The devil's advocate:  they are only intuitive to the artist who
> invented them.  I can't guess what they are supposed to be without
> coaching.  I hate learning a whole new set of icons;  I've memorized
> those that I use.  There will always be people who like shiny new
> things.  And there will always be people who prefer to stay with the
> known and comfortable.


Hahaha, good point. XD

Obviously, there are as much preferences as users, but when I said "more
intuitive" I refer to "things that a lot of people consider the same".

I'm web and graphical designer and I'm specialized at usability and
accesibility and, of course, there are a lot of things that are very
easy and clear for several persons but really difficult to understand to
others...

But, for example, if a person must choose between two action buttons, a
"V / green" is commonly associated to "OK" and "X / red" is known to be
something like "cancel".

A "trash can" is commonly associated to "Delete" and an icon that
symbolized a "paper with a bend corner" is commonly associated to a
file, not a directory... this kind of stuff

Of course, I'm not suggesting that Papirus is the "best" and "unique"
icon theme... and of course there will be a lot of people that will
change this icon theme for another one as soon they can... but, the
point is:

+ Is Papirus less intuitive than Rodent? I think no.

+ What do you think it is better?:

A) Starting XFCE for the first time and see your desktop with Rodent
icons mixed with other theme icon (If the selected icon theme don't have
a candidate for one icon, the GTK loads the inherit icon theme and/or
the default icon) do you not are able to control (because depending on
your distro, the default theme it will be different and unknown)

B) Starting XFCE for the first time and see your desktop totally uniform?

I think the B option is extremely better.


I'm not saying Rodent is a ugly or bad theme. I like it and I'm sure
there are a lot of people who like and use it. I'm saying Papirus has a
lot of advantages Rodent does not have. For example:

+ Specific icon versions for several sizes like 16px, 22px, 24px, 32px,
48px, 64px... (Rodent has only 48px version and downscaling SVG version
does not grant the icons could be recognizable and pixel-fit).

+ Papirus contain 2620 apps icons (Rodent has 78). In fact, when you use
Rodent, the majority of icons XFCE uses are not from Rodent. They are
from another icon theme setting as default one (Usually Tango).



Look at these screen shots:

http://pasteall.org/pic/show.php?id=117661

In this one, you can see that Rodent has no a XFBurn icon (Which is a
XFCE application!!). Even more, except the "Folder" icon, all the
application icons inherits from TANGO icon. The default and fall-back
Gnome icon theme...

If you look closer, you can see the XFBurn top bar icons in the left
(with Rodent (Tango, really)) are not designed for this size, only the
"Erase CD-RW" and "Reload" icons are designed for be used in this size,
and the others are downscaled and they don't look well at all... and
they are significantly different to others...


http://pasteall.org/pic/show.php?id=117662

In this one, almost every configuration icon is not from Rodent!!! They
are from the default and fall-back Tango icon theme.

In both cases, Papirus has all icons needed and does not depends on
other default and no-XFCE-related icon theme.




My suggestion wasn't about a "subjective beauty competition" rather than
"objective facts", and we all be agree about Papirus fits on well with
XFCE better than XFCE's own icon theme. ;)


Please, consider it. ;)


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Re: Suggestion: Change Default Icon Theme

Ralf Mardorf
Hi,

the theme isn't provided by official Arch Linux repositories and the
Arch User Repository maintainers for papirus and congener chose
disgusting versioning for the PKGBUILDs, that are most of the times only
provided from git, counting the commits.

However, I will try to build papirus and congener using the Arch User
repository PKGBUILDs and perhaps take a look at the icons [1].

I couldn't find it using the Debian Package Tracker [2] or using the
Ubuntu Packages Search [3].

To make something the default for a desktop environment, it should
already be available by packages from official repositories of major
distros.

Regards,
Ralf

[1]
$ yaourt -S papirus-icon-theme-git paper-icon-theme pop-icon-theme-git sardi-mono-papirus-colora-variations-icons-git papirus-claws-mail-theme-git

[2]
https://tracker.debian.org/

[3]
https://packages.ubuntu.com/
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Re: Suggestion: Change Default Icon Theme

Mark-525
In reply to this post by jEsuSdA 8)-2
On Sat, 29 Jul 2017 20:42:48 +0200
"jEsuSdA 8)" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> + It could brings a great refresh to XFCE look.

Why are you putting this under "advantages"?  One of the things I
really like about XFCE is that it doesn't have periodic "refreshes"
that require me to figure out what everything looks like today, and
re-learn how to do things.

--
Mark Wagner
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Re: Suggestion: Change Default Icon Theme

Kristian Rink
In reply to this post by jEsuSdA 8)-2
Am Sonntag, den 30.07.2017, 21:04 +0200 schrieb jEsuSdA 8):
>
>
> B) Starting XFCE for the first time and see your desktop totally
> uniform?
>

Well written, thanks. Maybe, though, it's not a matter of XFCE in
general but rather something that should be addressed by XFCE
distributed in particular distributions. That would leave "vanilla
XFCE" as-is for all those who got used to it and still give people a
chance to provide a different experience to different user groups. See
GNOME in Antergos. ;)

Cheers,
Kristian
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